HALE: --peer pressure, even when they are in high school, you know, you have, uh, some students who go to the technical school, for a certain period of time, uh, in a year or a day, you know, so much--

LANE: Right, right.

HALE: --so many hours a day. And there's such pressure--what I saw, I guess basically was, with my son was in high school, and he was having, uh, a challenge getting into a chemistry class that he really needed. I--what I observed were a lot of people taking classes basically, that they really didn't have any reason to take.

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: They were taking up space, and I got to thinking about, uh, you know, people have different talents, and some people need to go to, to get advanced degrees, and some people don't--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --and, if there was any way to remove the stigma, basically, 1:00that seems to exist with young people who were taking some type of vocational training--

LANE: Right.

HALE: --and, but at the same time, the job requirements have changed significantly to the point that people need to have at least good communication skills--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --in addition to technical skills--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --to do well.

LANE: Right.

HALE: And so when the governor came up with the thought of, uh, removing the community colleges from the University of Kentucky, and combining them with the technical schools, I was all in favor of it.

LANE: Hmm.

HALE: Because what happens is, if you take away the sort of that peer pressure, that stigma--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --because they're going to the community college.

LANE: Right.

HALE: It's the community technical college.

LANE: That's right.

HALE: And so, you know, you have some of them that are on the career path, they're getting two years to go on to get the four-year degree, 2:00but you have some that are getting what I consider to be technical degrees.

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: And there's no stigma anymore associated with I'm going to the technical school--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --I'm going to college.

LANE: Um-hm, exactly, because it's all one unit.

HALE: Ex-, exactly.

LANE: Just makes it--

HALE: So I was very much in favor of it for those reasons.

LANE: Were you on his task force, Jean?

HALE: No, actually, I wasn't on the governor's task force--

LANE: Okay.

HALE: --uh, he just went around the state--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --and, uh, where I was involved with Prestonsburg Community College--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --and believed the way that I believed--

LANE: Sure.

HALE: --uh, he went--he had a session at Morehead and, uh, I just took the time to drive to Morehead and participate in it, because I wanted to say what I wanted to say.

LANE: Terrific, well, that's wonderful.

HALE: -----------(??).

LANE: That's good. Uh, someone had to take a broad view, didn't they, that situation as, as you know, with each community and their community colleges, and their technical schools, everybody had a vested interest, but, but the big broad view taken by Patton and folks like you, was 3:00that this makes an awful lot of sense.

HALE: Well, and, and I, I actually was chairing, uh, Prestonsburg Community College's board when it made the transition to become the Big Sandy Community and Technical College.

LANE: Ah, okay, great.

HALE: Okay, and having, I guess, uh, had experience myself, uh, with the fact that our company changed its name after ninety-some years--

LANE: Oh, my gosh.

HALE: --uh, we--

LANE: That's right.

HALE: --we, we had done acquisitions and ran, uh, at one time sixteen different banks, and--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --they were, the names were geographically, you know, the name of the holding company was geographically limiting in the fact that it was Pikeville National Corporation, that doesn't sell very well in Summersville, West Virginia, or Campbellsville, Kentucky.

LANE: Right, right.

HALE: So, we did, uh, what was tough for those of us that had been around for a long time. We made the decision to change the name of 4:00our company.

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: And, so I have been through that process, and I knew that the only people that had any real problem with it were the people working for the company.

LANE: Right, that's true.

HALE: But the community truly did not have any problem with it, so--

LANE: Hmm.

HALE: --I was able to take that experience, and, you know, there were some board members who were opposed to it, but not the majority.

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: And you know, I just basically told them, I said, "You know, you can, you know, do these things the right way, put things in the newspaper, ask for public suggestion and comment, da, da, da, da, da."

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: But I said, "Bottom line, what you'll find is that the only people who care who were the people internally."

LANE: Um-hm, yeah.

HALE: So, uh, I was able to, I, I believe, make some assistance in making the change in that particular community, as far as the consolidation to become Big Sandy Community and Technical College was concerned.


LANE: Um-hm. Was it, is the, so it wasn't as difficult as you, as some thought it might be--I mean I'm--

HALE: No--

LANE: Right.

HALE: --no, it wasn't, uh, it was, the, the challenges that they faced was the integration of the two staffs.

LANE: Right, right.

HALE: And, and a, you know, the public viewpoint of maybe a half dozen people--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --who had--

LANE: Very vocal people. (laughs)

HALE: Yeah, very vocal people who had pride in Prestonsburg and I take nothing away from pride in community--

LANE: No, no.

HALE: --like Pikeville National, I mean I spent thirty-some years answering my phone, uh, Jean Hale, Pikeville National, may I help you? Instead of saying Jean Hale, Community Trust may I help you?

LANE: Right, right.

HALE: And so I know the emotional attachment that you have in, in making that kind of transition, but having had the experience, I can tell people, it really doesn't matter--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --as much as you would like to think that it does--

LANE: Um-hm.


HALE: --in the people you're serving in the community, it really doesn't matter.

LANE: Hmm, wow. Well that's, I, I think they were very fortunate to have you, uh, leading that charge because, um, you kind of had to be the voice of reason, I'm, I'm sure many times.

HALE: Oh yes, absolutely--(Lane laughs)--and you know, having been through it, uh, I mean I knew, I mean, you know, Prestonsburg Community College wasn't as old as, as Pikeville National Bank was when the transaction, or the change in names occurred.

LANE: That's right.

HALE: So, you know, having been there, done that, gives you a different perspective--

LANE: Right.

HALE: --and, uh, I did not have any problem in, in sharing that or communicating it with them. I'm sure some of them had a problem hearing it, but, you know, that's reality in this world.

LANE: Yes it is, it really is, and as you say, what you do and the lives you change in this instance, are just so much more important than just -----------(??).

HALE: Oh, it is, you know, community pride, I mean, uh, Prestonsburg had 7:00just opened a, a Pikeville campus--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --and, you know, that was important, and, you know, what the, the structure that McCall did, uh, with his, uh, universities, he and I talked about it one time, it's, it's very similar. I operate this company with, uh, four regions--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --and it, it, then markets, uh, individual markets underneath those regions--

LANE: Um-hm, um-hm.

HALE: --I have, I have regional presidents, I have market presidents underneath the regional, so, you know, what he developed for KCTCS with the combination of the community and technical colleges was, uh, uh, a lot of similarity between what would happen--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --in a private sector situation.

LANE: Um-hm, you're exactly right. Uh--(sighs)--so, when did you become chair of the foundation board?

HALE: Gosh, this is my second term, we just changed the rules--

LANE: Oh, right.

HALE: --I can't tell you the exact date.

LANE: Oh that's fine--

HALE: -----------(??).

LANE: --I'll get it, but sec-, you are in your second term, that's, as 8:00the chair--

HALE: Uh, yes, I am in my second term, so.

LANE: Good, good deal.

HALE: So, I guess it was--a year, over a year, almost two years ago.

LANE: Okay, okay.

HALE: So you can only serve in the officer positions, I think a year at a time, and--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: -----------(??) and we changed it to do two years, so.

LANE: Oh great, that's, that's a little more reasonable, isn't it?

HALE: Yeah.

LANE: If, if you're--

HALE: Well it provides, we talked about it, and it provided continuity.

LANE: Right.

HALE: Uh, because where you have a limited number of meetings annually, um, it's hard to maintain--

LANE: Yeah.

HALE: --some continuity with people just serving one, one year.

LANE: Now that would just be four meetings, technically, wouldn't it?

HALE: Yes.

LANE: Okay, yeah, that's a good idea, actually. Um, tell me, let's talk about the, the galas, um, those are quite wonderful events, and I, I credit y-, the board and the staff for, for making those things-- they're almost like the academy awards, aren't they?

HALE: Yes, they are very nice events, and it just gives public recognition to the importance of the partnership between the private 9:00sector and the, the, uh, state supported institutions.

LANE: Yeah, and I think you have to do those in a style that says, we're not flamboyant, and we're not wasting money, but we know what we're doing.

HALE: Well, bottom line, uh, you know, they're paid for by sponsors--

LANE: That's right, that's right.

HALE: --so it's not an expense to--

LANE: Right.

HALE: --the foundation or to the college.

LANE: That's right, and, and as, um, I was involved at the History Center and with their foundation and, and board, and, and you have to honestly, the bottom line too is you have to portray a certain level of sophistication, you just do.

HALE: Um-hm.

LANE: I, I think, not overly, but you just have to say, w-, we know, we know how to treat people and we know how to be hospitable, and, and that's what we are about so--

HALE: Um-hm.

LANE: --those, those events are, are, have been quite, uh, quite amazing, I think and I was looking back through the history and the, 10:00the people you've honored, and the people you brought together, it's just been, it says an awful lot about support for this system.

HALE: Well it does, you know, you talk about the, the only thing that I guess I, you know, and all these things are a matter of opinion--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --the only thing that I'm not, that doesn't make me feel with, as, as good, is, is the way that they march them in.

LANE: You don't like that?


LANE: How interesting, okay, okay. I've, I've only attended one, you feel like that's a little over the top?

HALE: Yeah.

LANE: Okay, then maybe you can take care of that. (both laugh) I have confidence you can. Um, let's see, let's--

HALE: And I've never said that to anybody.

LANE: And I won't, I won't write that down at all, but I, I think that's, you're right, it is a matter of opinion. I, I noticed that when I attended my first one, which is one bef-, before this one, and I thought, oh wow, those people either feel like the most wonderful, 11:00popular people in the world, or they are totally embarrassed, either one, one or the other, you know?

HALE: Yeah, yeah.

LANE: (laughs) Um, g-, ch-, can you tell me about some of the projects that you have known that the foundation's been involved in, or a project that just stands out in your mind as something that made you particularly feel, you know, this was really good to be involved here and, uh, do you all get feedback on some of the projects you've supported?

HALE: Uh, yes we do, and, um, you know, I, I really like the concept of the partnership, uh, to meet the needs of businesses in the community.

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: And, uh, you know, you've got two prime examples and, and, uh, one is the, the coal academy--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --it, which occurred because there is a, a great shortage of, of qualified people for that industry--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --because the average age in that industry right now, I think, is fifty-four.

LANE: Wow, yeah.

HALE: And so, you know, a lot of--there needs to be an understanding 12:00that, that the industry has changed some, and that there's, you know, there is a different technical skill set that's needed today--

LANE: Right.

HALE: --than what was needed in my father's time.

LANE: That's right.

HALE: The other one is, uh, the racing academy.

LANE: Yes.

HALE: Uh, the fact that they're, did not exist any, uh, means by which people could learn the right kind of skills--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --for that industry.

LANE: Um-hm, yeah that, that's quite a wonderful story, and, and, honestly, if, if KCTCS had depended on state funds for those types of start-up, uh, moneys, I'm, I'm not sure that, they would have happened as quickly, or if at all.

HALE: Uh, they wouldn't of, would not, I, you know, they probably would not have--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --but, but the bottom line is, it would be a justification of an, of a need by business--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --and a willingness of, of KCTCS, from an educational perspective, to help fill, to fill that need.


LANE: Right, right.

HALE: And, you know, I've got one that I've mentioned to Dr. McCall, and, and I haven't talked with him, I, I guess in a few months on it, but I'm not turning loose of it. (both laugh) There is a, a great need in the financial services industry, if you look, the turnover. The turnover that we experience and other financial institutions within the state experience is in the teller position.

LANE: Wow.

HALE: And what happens is, uh, with the skill set that's necessary today, you're hiring college graduates--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --and bottom line is, that the college graduate, they'll, they'll take that position to get their foot in the door--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --but if they are not moved in, in six months--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --they're going someplace else.

LANE: Wow, yeah.

HALE: And so the, the primary point of customer service for our client base, is the teller.

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: And people don't like revolving doors, they like familiar faces.

LANE: True, true.

HALE: And years ago, and we still have some of them employed, and I'm 14:00sure other financial institutions do to, you could get some really bright people out of, out of high school, and, uh, they would train to be tellers and they would love it, and they would still be tellers today. So that's a continuity that you would like to see, but it takes a different skill set today than it took thirty years ago.

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: And, we do an extensive amount of training, and I'm sure that other financial institutions do too, and I suggested to Dr. McCall that, that we look, I, I'm sure that, you know, there would be some support from a consortium of financial institutions throughout the entire state.

LANE: Um-hm, I, I would think--

HALE: To--

LANE: --that would, there would be a great, uh, need and, as you say, uh, KCTCS could fill that, that need well.

HALE: --you know, some type of an associate degree, with--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --certification program, you know--

LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --which is a certified teller-type program.

LANE: I see what you're saying.

HALE: And you're identifying people who are going to be happy--


LANE: Um-hm.

HALE: --in that career--

LANE: Makes sense.

HALE: --that position.

LANE: Makes a lot of sense, and I--

HALE: Instead of being, uh, people with a skill set that are only going to be happy in that position for six months.

LANE: Yeah, because, because they feel like they should be moved--

HALE: Oh, absolutely.

LANE: --elsewhere, yeah.

HALE: But if, if, if you, you pick up a different, uh, client base, basically, student base, uh, by pulling something through the community and technical college, in a, a teller certification type program--

LANE: Wow.

HALE: Those are people who are going to be interested in being tellers.

LANE: Um-hm, um-hm, and be the best ones, and be hi-, be trained for that--

HALE: Exactly.

LANE: --specifically for that, yeah. Well, that makes a lot of sense. I have n-, I'm going to watch, I'll bet you get that done pretty soon, actually. (laughs)

HALE: I'm, I'm been working on it. (laughs)

LANE: You will, you will. I know you need to go. Do you have any wrap- up quotes for our ten-year history, anything you'd like to, to just say, or, for the record?

HALE: Well, basically, I guess, what I would say for House Bill 40, was 16:00it 401? The new, uh, House Bill 1--

LANE: House Bill 1 in '97, right, right.

HALE: Yeah, for House Bill 1, I said--I've got, I've got ----------(??) 404 on my mind.

LANE: Yeah, right.

HALE: --for House Bill 1, to me, the, the most evident and greatest success coming out of House Bill 1 has been KCTCS--

LANE: Um-hm, yep, yep.

HALE: --it's been the most visible success of House Bill 1.

LANE: Yeah, I agree with you.

HALE: So--

LANE: Excellent.

HALE: --you know, I might phrase that a little bit better in a, and, if you were to use it as a quote, but I think--

LANE: Well, it sounds good to me, I, I think that's exactly right, the most evident, and the, the greatest success of House Bill 1 has been KCTCS.

HALE: Yes.

LANE: Yeah, thank you, I really appreciate it. And I hope to get to see you soon.

HALE: (laughs) Well, I'll be down there Wednesday.


LANE: Good, good.

HALE: Okay.

LANE: Take care.

HALE: You too, bye.

LANE: Bye.

[End of interview.]

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